Comments on: Evolution: The Atheist’s Religion–Part 1–The Why and the Background http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/ by Andy J. Biery Wed, 25 Nov 2009 23:57:23 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: Abbie http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/#comment-5645 Abbie Fri, 17 Apr 2009 03:27:10 +0000 http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/?p=546#comment-5645 They don't have your teacher's biology book on the internet, and I'm definitely not going to buy it for that price, but the other two are now officially on hold in my name. I will try to read them if I have any free time at all in the near future. They don’t have your teacher’s biology book on the internet, and I’m definitely not going to buy it for that price, but the other two are now officially on hold in my name. I will try to read them if I have any free time at all in the near future.

]]> By: Andy http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/#comment-5644 Andy Fri, 17 Apr 2009 00:11:43 +0000 http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/?p=546#comment-5644 i know i didnt answer any questions, i said i wouldn't here in this comment section. the fact that i believe evolution and creation as explanations for the origin of life (either from the start or as we see it today) to be much more philosophical than scientific is going to take me a lot of posts to cover. P.S. I knew it was mr. williamson that got you into believing all this. i remember you talking about it back then. i know i didnt answer any questions, i said i wouldn’t here in this comment section.

the fact that i believe evolution and creation as explanations for the origin of life (either from the start or as we see it today) to be much more philosophical than scientific is going to take me a lot of posts to cover.

P.S. I knew it was mr. williamson that got you into believing all this. i remember you talking about it back then.

]]> By: Patrick http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/#comment-5643 Patrick Thu, 16 Apr 2009 15:36:03 +0000 http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/?p=546#comment-5643 P.S. Abbie- ignore the amazon review, whoever wrote that doesn't know what they are talking about. Read the first customer review for an idea of what the book is like. P.S. Abbie- ignore the amazon review, whoever wrote that doesn’t know what they are talking about. Read the first customer review for an idea of what the book is like.

]]> By: Patrick http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/#comment-5642 Patrick Thu, 16 Apr 2009 15:30:39 +0000 http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/?p=546#comment-5642 Abbie- I'm not in any great position to be recommending books I guess since I haven't really read any Biology books since high school. I really wish everyone who wants to have an informed opinion on this subject would just read or even skim a basic high school level biology book (for instance: http://www.amazon.com/Biology-Exploring-Life-Neil-Campbell/dp/0132509253/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239894481&sr=1-1 written by my high school science teacher and someone who through personal one-on-one experience I know has no hidden agenda and is definitely not out to persecute anyone, ridicule anyone, or make "war on God" or whatever nonsense) and then follow it with something like this http://www.amazon.com/Evolution-Mark-Ridley/dp/1405103450/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239894222&sr=1-8 but I know most people would rather not go to all that trouble which, unless they are pretty interested in biology, is understandable. Plus they are textbook prices, but maybe they could be found at a library somewhere? The only other book I found on amazon (and I looked at a bunch) that wasn't borderline or outright garbage seems pretty good: http://www.amazon.com/What-Evolution-Ernst-Mayr/dp/0465044263/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239894391&sr=1-14 I haven't read it but the author and material seems as legit as it gets. The single problem I could see with that book being one probably would need a lot of supplemental material to get much out of it should one endeavor to read it. Which, again, people really should read, at the very least, a basic biology book before forming many opinions, in my estimation. Andy- You answered exactly zero of my questions. I have little doubt most of that stuff is verifiable. My real problem was with the statement I quoted, which is misinformation. Abbie-
I’m not in any great position to be recommending books I guess since I haven’t really read any Biology books since high school. I really wish everyone who wants to have an informed opinion on this subject would just read or even skim a basic high school level biology book (for instance: http://www.amazon.com/Biology-Exploring-Life-Neil-Campbell/dp/0132509253/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239894481&sr=1-1 written by my high school science teacher and someone who through personal one-on-one experience I know has no hidden agenda and is definitely not out to persecute anyone, ridicule anyone, or make “war on God” or whatever nonsense) and then follow it with something like this http://www.amazon.com/Evolution-Mark-Ridley/dp/1405103450/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239894222&sr=1-8 but I know most people would rather not go to all that trouble which, unless they are pretty interested in biology, is understandable. Plus they are textbook prices, but maybe they could be found at a library somewhere? The only other book I found on amazon (and I looked at a bunch) that wasn’t borderline or outright garbage seems pretty good: http://www.amazon.com/What-Evolution-Ernst-Mayr/dp/0465044263/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239894391&sr=1-14
I haven’t read it but the author and material seems as legit as it gets. The single problem I could see with that book being one probably would need a lot of supplemental material to get much out of it should one endeavor to read it. Which, again, people really should read, at the very least, a basic biology book before forming many opinions, in my estimation.
Andy-
You answered exactly zero of my questions. I have little doubt most of that stuff is verifiable. My real problem was with the statement I quoted, which is misinformation.

]]> By: Andy http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/#comment-5640 Andy Tue, 14 Apr 2009 01:44:03 +0000 http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/?p=546#comment-5640 hey bro this is only 1 post of many. i'm just getting started yo. let me finish completely (prob take me a while). :) the book i read, "the long war against God" gave me the framework for how i'm writing about this topic, yes. but i could easily link to wikipedia for what i posted here (and i did use wiki to help me write this up). The stuff about Plato, Aristotle, Thales, Atomism, and Epicureanism is easily verifiable. hey bro this is only 1 post of many. i’m just getting started yo. let me finish completely (prob take me a while). :)

the book i read, “the long war against God” gave me the framework for how i’m writing about this topic, yes. but i could easily link to wikipedia for what i posted here (and i did use wiki to help me write this up). The stuff about Plato, Aristotle, Thales, Atomism, and Epicureanism is easily verifiable.

]]> By: Abbie http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/#comment-5639 Abbie Tue, 14 Apr 2009 00:10:56 +0000 http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/?p=546#comment-5639 Patrick, if you can recommend me one really excellent scientific book that you believe lays out a great case in favor of evolution, I would love to read it. I'm too lazy to try to find one myself. I don't necessarily agree with you that there is no evidence out there that can validate creationism, but even if that is the case, what exactly is there that explains how a nonliving organism became a living organism through pure chance? Aren't any theories about the actual origin of man - or anything else - pure speculation? Patrick, if you can recommend me one really excellent scientific book that you believe lays out a great case in favor of evolution, I would love to read it. I’m too lazy to try to find one myself.

I don’t necessarily agree with you that there is no evidence out there that can validate creationism, but even if that is the case, what exactly is there that explains how a nonliving organism became a living organism through pure chance? Aren’t any theories about the actual origin of man – or anything else – pure speculation?

]]> By: Patrick http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/#comment-5638 Patrick Mon, 13 Apr 2009 20:23:24 +0000 http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/?p=546#comment-5638 A few questions: 1. I realize you are probably summarizing, but how much of this comes from the book you read? Like, 100% or what? 2. Do you realize how one sided and full of strawmen all this? 3. When was the last time you read anything that treated evolution scientifically and not philosophically? Ever? If only to provide a small counterpoint to your one-sided take on, well, everything: "I will be working from an idea that an acceptance of evolution is just as much a faith as creationism, and no more a science than creationism." Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and most things can be argued, but this statement is false whether you "believe" it or not. There is no evidence for the account of creation provided in the bible (or a lot of other stuff in there) outside of the bible, thus it can only be taken on faith. There is overwhelming evidence (that continues to mount) that evolution does in fact take place. The difference is in the evidence, the research of which makes it science. If you personally choose to believe that science fails or ceases to exist only in the cases that don't agree with your worldview then that is your decision, but it doesn't address the fact that there has been more research on the subject than you apparently care to imagine, or bother to learn about. Other than through propaganda. A few questions:

1. I realize you are probably summarizing, but how much of this comes from the book you read? Like, 100% or what?
2. Do you realize how one sided and full of strawmen all this?
3. When was the last time you read anything that treated evolution scientifically and not philosophically? Ever?

If only to provide a small counterpoint to your one-sided take on, well, everything:
“I will be working from an idea that an acceptance of evolution is just as much a faith as creationism, and no more a science than creationism.”
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and most things can be argued, but this statement is false whether you “believe” it or not. There is no evidence for the account of creation provided in the bible (or a lot of other stuff in there) outside of the bible, thus it can only be taken on faith. There is overwhelming evidence (that continues to mount) that evolution does in fact take place. The difference is in the evidence, the research of which makes it science. If you personally choose to believe that science fails or ceases to exist only in the cases that don’t agree with your worldview then that is your decision, but it doesn’t address the fact that there has been more research on the subject than you apparently care to imagine, or bother to learn about. Other than through propaganda.

]]> By: Andy http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/#comment-5636 Andy Thu, 09 Apr 2009 21:29:06 +0000 http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/?p=546#comment-5636 I'm pretty sure Darwin believed everything he wrote by the time he wrote it. The guy you are thinking of is Alfred Russel Wallace, I'll talk about him and other things surrounding the Origin publishing in my next post. As for what i'm arguing, i'm not specifically arguing against atheism with these posts--its more implied that i'm against it. I guess I assume most reading these posts know me so I haven't come right out and said "I'm completely against atheism!!" I'm probably trying too hard to be objective in my writing on atheism, though if you read other posts by me i'm usually completely nonobjective. I’m pretty sure Darwin believed everything he wrote by the time he wrote it. The guy you are thinking of is Alfred Russel Wallace, I’ll talk about him and other things surrounding the Origin publishing in my next post.

As for what i’m arguing, i’m not specifically arguing against atheism with these posts–its more implied that i’m against it. I guess I assume most reading these posts know me so I haven’t come right out and said “I’m completely against atheism!!” I’m probably trying too hard to be objective in my writing on atheism, though if you read other posts by me i’m usually completely nonobjective.

]]> By: Anonymous http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/2009/04/08/evolution-the-atheists-religion-pt-1/#comment-5633 Anonymous Thu, 09 Apr 2009 05:25:06 +0000 http://whoreadsthis.wordpress.com/?p=546#comment-5633 If I'm correct, the publishing of "Origins" almost did not take place because it conflicted so strongly with Darwin's beliefs, but when he found out that somebody else was planning on publishing a similar "discovery," he figured he might as well go ahead and take credit.... Are you arguing for or against athiesm? If I’m correct, the publishing of “Origins” almost did not take place because it conflicted so strongly with Darwin’s beliefs, but when he found out that somebody else was planning on publishing a similar “discovery,” he figured he might as well go ahead and take credit….

Are you arguing for or against athiesm?

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